In need of advice

[igcr]

Hi guys!

I need a little help to improve an specific kind of photography.

I've been shooting dancers and performers, in very low light situation.
I am currently using a Nikon D80 w/ 18-70mm lens 1:3.5 - 4.5G and a built-in flash. For now is all the equipment I have.

So here are the questions:
How can I improve this kind of photos? Should I use flash? Do I need to use the built- in flash in a different direction? Those are a very very fast subjects. I've been using 1600 ISO as the highest and the lowest aperture possible f3.5, the speed has been variable, some w/movement some others very dark and not using flash. honestly the low lights at the stage have been really cool to kill them with the flash! Oh, I forgot to mention that in all these cases I had the opportunity to be very close to the dancers so "long distance" is not a problem.

I attached some samples of "my not so cool pics", but I would like to get better images next time. There are important events coming up and i don't want to miss the opportunity to get better results!

Thank you so much in advance.

Idalia

[Iguanasan]

You have your widest aperture and your highest ISO in play already. To brighten up these subjects the only tool left at your disposal is to add light unless someone has some better ideas. The problem with a flash is that you run the risk of blinding the dancers. It would be better, if you have any influence with the dancers, to have them add a few extra lights to their show.

The only other thing I could think of would be to catch them at points where they are more at rest and use a longer shutter speed.

[Mad Aussie]

You are asking a lot with the lens you have I think judging by those photos. Especially not using the flash. I'd start by asking about that and if you are allowed to use it then try it for sure.
Some of those shots were at speeds around 1/30th of a sec ... way too slow for heand holding but, 2nd sync (curtain) flash can certainly make for some interesting shots at slow shutter speeds too.

1600 ISO is going to produce some heavy noise most likely. A f3.5 lens is simply going to struggle without more light of some sort.
If the budget allows maybe a cheap 50mm prime f1.8 (about $US100 last I look which admittedly was awhileago before all the dollars crashed) is the ticket although you may be too close to the dancers for that.

About the only thing I can think of with the equipment you have for now (assuming flash is not an option) is to position yourself somewhere where the lights are coming from your location or behind you and hitting the dancers ... light source from over your shoulder or whatever. Then it's timing to hit the button when the lgihts strikes right.

If Acadie Libre finds this thread he might have some ideas as he shoots in these conditions often. He offered some advice to someone else in another thread about similar circumstances recently so maybe search that out for answers too.

[jellotranz]

Some of those shots were at speeds around 1/30th of a sec ... way too slow for heand holding but

I personally have found that 1/30th isn't a problem when it comes to handholding, its more a problem of the people themselves start to blur. but... While Mad Aussie certainly is correct, unless you are shooting with a 17mm lens, handholding a 1/30 shot is much much harder. What will help with that (Assuming the location works for this) is lower your center of gravity. The taller you are, the more you are going to wobble and this will ruin the picture do to camera shake.

If you can Crouch down somewhat like you would to propose marriage. It will get your center of gravity lower and will probably get you a stop or 2 more as far as hand holding than you could do just standing up. Here are 2 examples of what I mean, one is my wife shooting an indoor show, and one is me shooting at a small outdoor bar. As long as you crouching down doesn't obscure your view, use it, your pictures will be sharper!

http://www.deviantdonkey.info/v1/pblog/galleries/misc/images/20090407132506_2l4d0775-edit.jpg

http://www.deviantdonkey.info/v1/pblog/galleries/misc/images/20090407132432_dsc_1068.jpg

[Mad Aussie]

Yes I should have been more specific about that. Not too mention spelling 'hand' properly :) I reguarly shoot well under 1/60th if I'm using wide angles in low light.

Adding to this ... It is said that a person sitting in a chair, trying to be still, is unlikely to be caught sharp in a photo at under 1/60th due to movements they make without realising it even. Breathing, a slight sway from refocusing their eyes etc, can be enough to introduce small amounts of blur to your shot.
With moving dancers you are going to need higher speeds for sharp images. One trick is to try to shoot them as they transition from one movement to another. Tricky but often they are 'still' for that split second as they change direction etc. Burst mode might help.

[jellotranz]

Lol, my spelling is so bad, I type my messages in MS Word first.. I figured you knew what I meant and just didn’t clarify… Speaking of clarifying… One thing to consider when talking about shutter speed and freezing a persons movement. The further away from the camera or should I say the smaller they are in your frame directly affects what speed it takes to freeze movement. The smaller they are in your frame the slower your shutter speed can be before they start to blur. Full frame Closeups require almost no noticeable movement to blur portions of the subject.

[Alex Wilson]

There are a couple different techniques you might try:

-Slow sync flash. A long exposure with the flash still firing will give you both the blur from movement and a clearer, frozen figure as well (if you have the option of rear-curtain sync, then you can choose whether the frozen image is at the start or the beginning)
-Multiple flash firings within a long exposure
-Moving to an off-camera flash. The on-camera flash is going to flatten your subjects, and usually give you ugly shadows. Bouncing the flash may be a good option, too.

The last book of images I did was all motion-themed, so I've shot a *lot* of motion images. Most of mine were in the studio, so I had the luxury of controlled backgrounds and being able to use studio lights to freeze the action when I wanted. But some of it was out of the studio, and for those it boiled down to trying to capture a frozen image (with a wide aperture, fast lens, and a steady hand) or going for an intentional blur. If you're trying to take images that convey to feeling of a dance, sometimes you don't want everything frozen.

My motion galleries (nudity warning):
http://alexwilsonphoto.com/gallery/fineart/motion/
http://alexwilsonphoto.com/gallery/fineart/motion2/
http://alexwilsonphoto.com/gallery/fineart/motion3/
Images from the book:
http://alexwilsonphoto.com/gallery/books/lacunal2/

[Marko]

Another excellent thread everyone:thankyou: Thanks so much for the great teaching!!:goodvibes

Alex you have some very beautiful and interesting images from your link. Very well done!

[Mad Aussie]

Lol, my spelling is so bad, I type my messages in MS Word first.. I figured you knew what I meant and just didn’t clarify…
I was talking about my own spelling not having a crack at yours :rolleyes:

[JAS_Photo]

Your galleries are very gorgeous Alex!

[AcadieLibre]

Alex great photos, and as Marko says says another great thread.

[igcr]

Thank you so much everybody for your help. Although the flash is not an option this time first, because I still don't know how to sync, (I will have to learn about it first) and second because I am usually very close to the dancers. I'll try to get a better lens soon based on recommendations.

Alex, by the way you have an amazing work! I Loved the motion!