Neg.art

[Shinnen]

Hi all,
I LOVE, what Sony calls, 'neg.art'. (I 'think' it's the electronic negative of a digital picture.) It seems to turn the brain around, so that what was boring is now interesting. My favourite pictures are ones that, taken in the normal way, would usually end up in the delete bin.
Here's an example. (It was taken with a 13 year old dscF717.) I wish all cameras had the ability to view images in negative, but very few do.
P.S. If you have an image viewer with a negative view function you will be able to see this picture as it would appear 'normally'.

20751

[Marko]

Sony can call it what it likes :)
This is a very old darkroom technique and it works super well in BW as well. Google Sabbatier effect.

Although I find this image somewhat interesting, my usual my take is if the image doesn't work as a regular image, effects usually can not save it.
If you like this, you'll likely also like infra-red colour photography.

[Shinnen]

Hi Marko,
I had never heard of The Sabatier effect. I Googled it and came up with this description, "The Sabatier effect is produced by re-exposing a photographic material to light part way through the development process. This gives the resultant image both positive and negative qualities." Is this your understanding also.
As you may know my dscF717 is an infra-red (near IR) camera. When you say infra-red colour photography do you mean far IR?
..... john
P.S. I can combine the the IR function of my F717 with the neg.art function to produce an odd kind of image; but I don't think that this is what you're referring to.
The F717 is an amazing camera for being 14 years old.
Here's another example of what it will do. (This house looks NOTHING like this picture in reality.)

20752

[Marko]

Here's my take -


Hi Marko,
I had never heard of The Sabatier effect. I Googled it and came up with this description, "The Sabatier effect is produced by re-exposing a photographic material to light part way through the development process. This gives the resultant image both positive and negative qualities." Is this your understanding also.

Correct. Lots of people also (mistakenly) called this solarization.


As you may know my dscF717 is an infra-red (near IR) camera. When you say infra-red colour photography do you mean far IR?
..... john

Nope - I mean near IR, I didn't realize (forgot) your camera can do that.

So the reversal of tones ( neg art as you call it) does look like IR but it is not IR. IR (infra red) photography records tones we can't see. I shot BW film IR for a good 15 years - the hallmark aspect of shooting with it (for me) was that living objects emitted a glow. Here's an example (http://markokulik.com/galleries/portraits-and-self-portraits/cain/). Neg art simply shows the opposite tones of any scene.

P.S. I can combine the the IR function of my F717 with the neg.art function to produce an odd kind of image; but I don't think that this is what you're referring to.
The F717 is an amazing camera for being 14 years old.
Here's another example of what it will do. (This house looks NOTHING like this picture in reality.)

20752

[Shinnen]

Hi Marko,
Nice picture. You are an artist. The reason I thought you were referring to far IR is that you mentioned infra-red colour photography. My impression (and experience) is that near IR is colourless.
So, Sabatier 'negatives' would vary considerably, depending on the intensity and timing of exposure to light? I wonder how Sony creates neg.art images. Do they resemble Sabatiers?
....... john

[Marko]

So, Sabatier 'negatives' would vary considerably, depending on the intensity and timing of exposure to light? I wonder how Sony creates neg.art images. Do they resemble Sabatiers?

yup they would vary big time which is part of the fun.

Here's some images: you be the judge :) In terms of Sony neg art, since every colour has its opposite, to me, that is all that is going on here. Not new at all, just rebranded. All these techniques come from the film days. Unless I'm missing something, neg art is just the inversion of tonality and colour - Which is what looking at an actual film negative resembled. maybe that's what the name refers to. Pretty sure photoshop allowed you to do this in version 1 or 2. Hope that may help

https://www.google.ca/search?q=color+sabatier+effect&biw=1280&bih=939&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjPmKzK7szNAhWDWx4KHZesD4oQsAQIQA#tbm=is ch&q=sabatier+effect

since the term was so frequently confused with solarisation here's one more search

https://www.google.ca/search?q=color+sabatier+effect&biw=1280&bih=939&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjPmKzK7szNAhWDWx4KHZesD4oQsAQIQA#tbm=is ch&q=color+solarisation+from+film

[Risacher]

Photoshop still inverts images, just hit ctrl-I, or go to Image - Adjustments - Invert. It's a very basic feature, I'd be really surprised if it ever got taken out.

[Shinnen]

Yes. I know, that what Sony calls neg.art, can be had from several editors.
I did an experiment. I took a picture in normal mode and in neg.art mode, and then translated the normal image to negatives using both Irfanview and Photofiltre. The resulting 'negatives' were barely indistinguishable from the Sony neg.art image. So, yes, it's easily done. But I find many negative images so provocative and alluring, that it's nice to be able see and frame them in camera before shooting.
It's hard to imagine how one could confuse solarization and Sabatier, they're so so different.
By the way, the F717 also has solarization and sepia modes, in addition to neg.art IR. and normal
But the IR function is so severally crippled that I have to use very strong NDs to shoot during daylight.
Thanks for the shortcuts. I see what you mean. Nice pictures.
.... john