went out last night with a d3000

[noobclicker]

i bought a d3000 last week and ended up with this photo
bw homeless | Flickr - Photo Sharing! (http://flic.kr/p/aiekHd)
and then today traded in the the d3000 for a d5000

[theantiquetiger]

I am no expert and may be the last person on this board who needs to be critiquing a photo, but there are a few things that I didn't care for about this photo.

As for the photo itself, it is great, nice tones, etc.

The things I don't care for about this photo are:

1.- there is too much dead space along the bottom with the sidewalk

2.- I think the leaves are a distraction from the figure

3.- this maybe harsh, but I don't care for the subject matter. It's not that I don't want to see it, it's you capturing this man down on his luck and showing him in this state. I'm not sure if others feel this way. Now let's say he was sitting on the steps, crutches across his lap, and deep in thought (he knows you are taking his picture), but a personal photo of him like this just doesn't sit well with me.

Say for instance, a B&W shot down an alley with cardboard boxes and maybe you can make out a homeless figure(s),this shot is not a shot of a homeless person, but more of a city or street.

I am not sure if I am making my point clear, but it is just how I feel.

[theantiquetiger]

Just to make myself clear, I'm not trying to put you down for the shot. I just joined this site myself two days ago and don't even consider myself a novice photographer, so please take my critique with a grain of salt. I feel you should never take photos of people (you don't know) in public in a private matter (a photo of two people you don't know dancing at a festival is fine, but not of a man digging in a garbage can looking for food or sleeping on a sidewalk).

Now it would be different if you did a series on him (with him knowing), shot him in his ups and downs, like a great portrait shot of his face as it lights up when he tells a story, etc.

[theantiquetiger]

I found a great example here on the boards on this exact matter. Member Ernest did a project on homeless veterans and has a great shot of a guy without belittling him (IMO, your shot belittled the man).

"Yank them off the sidewalk" "Forgotten Veteran" (http://www.photography.ca/Forums/f33/forgotten-veteran-15500.html)

Noob, please don't take offense to my my critique. I feel all subjects need to be recorded, but some need to done delicately and I feel you missed it on this shot.

Mods - let me know if I am out of line on this critique. I have my own forum and I know the headaches you go through.

[Bambi]

first off, congrats on the d5000. that's what I have and I like it. :)

I know that taking photos of those down on their luck is not liked by everyone. I am okay with it (and have done it) because it tells a story. I am okay with the empty space as well as it gives the context of being alone. It's not on the ROT but I'm okay with that too in this photo. I think, though, that the contrast could be bumped a bit to have a greater difference between the whites and blacks.

[Marko]

I actually like this photo for its graphic strength. The comp is just fine to my eye.
I agree the photo could use a contrast boost, but bring back the highlights after the boost.
Hope that helps - marko

[Iguanasan]

I am no expert and may be the last person on this board who needs to be critiquing a photo, but there are a few things that I didn't care for about this photo.
...snip...
I am not sure if I am making my point clear, but it is just how I feel.

First off, Antiquetiger, the best way to learn more about photography is to spend time critiquing both other's work and your own so you are exactly the type of person to offer critique ;)

Everyone has their own emotions about the subject matter as it is a hugely personal choice. I will photograph just about anything as it's all just part of our human existence. In this case, since you really can't see his face he is rather anonymous. This helps point out the plight of some people in our society. As more such images make it to the public maybe people will pay attention to their situation more.

From a technical standpoint I think you could use a slightly stronger contrast boost as Marko pointed out and I'm not super happy with the bright white door and the reflections in the window but you gotta shoot 'em as you see 'em sometimes so there is not much you can do about that.

[theantiquetiger]

In this case, since you really can't see his face he is rather anonymous. This helps point out the plight of some people in our society. As more such images make it to the public maybe people will pay attention to their situation more.



I see it the other way, by not seeing his face and the subject not knowing he is being shot, I feel this shot is stealing something from him and the viewer(I am guessing he does not know he is being photographed). Are we even sure the man is homeless? He is dressed in a warm up, doesn't seem too dirty. He could have just been tired from walking on those crutches, and stopped to rest. IMO, this image does not tell the story the artist is looking for.

The following are two similar images on homelessness. I feel one the first one is very powerful and the second one steals from the subject and the viewer

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r198/theantiquetiger/homeless-woman-with-dogs.jpg

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r198/theantiquetiger/homeless.jpg

And like I said before, this image from Ernst tells a great story, you can see the pain in his eyes and every line in his face. I am a veteran of war and find this image VERY powerful

http://www.photography.ca/Forums/attachments/f33/12816d1311269136-forgotten-veteran-img-0051-forgottenveteran.jpg

I know we have gotten into critiquing subject matter and not the technical side of the print (maybe off topic). This subject (not homeless people, just subject matter itself) would make a great topic some where on the boards.

Just to make it clear, noob's image doesn't offend me or anything, I just feel it missed the mark on the subject matter, and maybe critiquing subject matter (and not technical side of the print) is more along the lines of taste in artwork. I have been all over these boards the last three days and have not seen much critiquing of the subject matter it self.

[noobclicker]

wow that was a lot more feed back than i was expecting
and yes the man is homeless and no he did not know i was capturing him while he slept
and i dont like messing with my pictures never have i used to use film for many years and if i dont take the pic right then it is never right for me
and no worries everyone has the right to their own opinion and i am not offended i take a lot of street shots and in the city that includes the homeless the lonely and the forgotten
one thing you may not see that i do see is those step are on a street rescue place that was closed down becuz of funding and that is what the pic is to me and just so you know in the future when i do take my photos i use my camera and a tripod on a mobility scooter so its not like i can be sneaky so most of my subjects do end up seeing me pointing my lens their way
and to me if i can grab the natural shot before they see me makes me feel i caught something natural and honest
my chosen subject matter offends some disgust a few even makes some look on in disdain but hopefully i have at least made everyone think of the forgotten so one day they may not be

[Gremlich]

Ernst packaged his quite differently. Not the same.

[Iguanasan]

I see it the other way, by not seeing his face and the subject not knowing he is being shot, I feel this shot is stealing something from him and the viewer(I am guessing he does not know he is being photographed). Are we even sure the man is homeless? He is dressed in a warm up, doesn't seem too dirty. He could have just been tired from walking on those crutches, and stopped to rest. IMO, this image does not tell the story the artist is looking for.

Honestly, I have to agree somewhat. The clothing and the new looking crutches did not convey the message of homelessness as it could have.


The following are two similar images on homelessness. I feel one the first one is very powerful and the second one steals from the subject and the viewer

I understand your feeling that the image is being "stolen" because the subject is not aware of the photograph and you are not the first person to make that point. I, however, do not agree. I do not believe that it is required to ask someone before taking their photograph. I do believe that you have to have a bit of social responsibility to photograph someone.


And like I said before, this image from Ernst tells a great story, you can see the pain in his eyes and every line in his face. I am a veteran of war and find this image VERY powerful

Yes, Ernst is very skilled at telling wonderful stories with his images.

Also, for future reference, you should post a link to images do not belong to you or at least hyperlink the image itself to the original posting. Posting some else's image without a link back to the original photographer is not really appropriate. In fact, I'd appreciate it if you could edit your post and fix that. I'm not sure how Marko feels about that but I know how I feel about it.


I know we have gotten into critiquing subject matter and not the technical side of the print (maybe off topic). This subject (not homeless people, just subject matter itself) would make a great topic some where on the boards.

The subject matter is part of the critique discussion when appropriate though not always. I think the subject matter is critiqued less often as the problem is usually not with the subject matter but with the technical and artistic skills to showcase the subject well. Someone's choice of subject matter is merely their choice.


Just to make it clear, noob's image doesn't offend me or anything, I just feel it missed the mark on the subject matter, and maybe critiquing subject matter (and not technical side of the print) is more along the lines of taste in artwork. I have been all over these boards the last three days and have not seen much critiquing of the subject matter it self.



wow that was a lot more feed back than i was expecting
and yes the man is homeless and no he did not know i was capturing him while he slept
and i dont like messing with my pictures never have i used to use film for many years and if i dont take the pic right then it is never right for me
and no worries everyone has the right to their own opinion and i am not offended i take a lot of street shots and in the city that includes the homeless the lonely and the forgotten
one thing you may not see that i do see is those step are on a street rescue place that was closed down becuz of funding and that is what the pic is to me and just so you know in the future when i do take my photos i use my camera and a tripod on a mobility scooter so its not like i can be sneaky so most of my subjects do end up seeing me pointing my lens their way
and to me if i can grab the natural shot before they see me makes me feel i caught something natural and honest
my chosen subject matter offends some disgust a few even makes some look on in disdain but hopefully i have at least made everyone think of the forgotten so one day they may not be

We do try to critique thoroughly, noobclicker, though it's generally much easier if you post a copy of the image rather than simply link to it. Then the image and the critique can be seen together.

Now knowing the circumstances I would have loved to have seen a sign identifying the location and the "closed" sign on top of it or something if such a bit existed. That would have definitely made for a more powerful image.

[Marko]

I found a great example here on the boards on this exact matter. Member Ernest did a project on homeless veterans and has a great shot of a guy without belittling him (IMO, your shot belittled the man).

"Yank them off the sidewalk" "Forgotten Veteran" (http://www.photography.ca/Forums/f33/forgotten-veteran-15500.html)

Noob, please don't take offense to my my critique. I feel all subjects need to be recorded, but some need to done delicately and I feel you missed it on this shot.

Mods - let me know if I am out of line on this critique. I have my own forum and I know the headaches you go through.


To be honest - I'm not sure posting your images in someone else's thread in this way is that cool. Posting someone else's photo directly is also not the coolest. Feel free to critique of course but for now please only post your own images in your own threads. (Still thinking about a general policy on this one). If you want to refer to another person's image, please just link to it. I am deleting Ernst's image from this thread as he gave no permission for you to post it.

members - Please DO NOT answer my post here , as this thread is about another member's image.... so no need to take it more off track. Of course feel free to PM me if anything ever concerns you.

Thx! Marko

[noobclicker]

i am new to the forums and was not sure how to post my photo and yes it would have been better if i had posted the pic
and the photo i took was in a very very busy area and getting the shot was a one shot deal or yes the sign would have been a good addition

[Marko]

I 100% see and realize that this shot was taken in (probably) under 10 seconds. I think you did a fine job here overall.

[noobclicker]

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6193/6102194106_f8f0a0c1c9_z.jpg
trying to see if this works

[thoughton]

Controversial subject, as usual :) Personally I think as long as the photo isn't belittling the subject then I have no problem with it. For me it's like street photography of obese people - if you're taking the photo for some reason other than their obesity then that's fine. If the obesity is the only thing of interest then it's not fine. Here the photo has a message, and you haven't invaded his privacy (he could have found a more sheltered spot!), so I'm fine with it.

[Marko]

I agree with this logic 100% Tim.